Do I need preventative PCT?

[pulphero]

First post here. Saw the youtube series and was impressed with the emphasis on clean gains and wanted to follow up. According to the sticky I need to post some vitals on my first post so I'm doing so here. I'm going to throw everything in so if it gets long, I apologize.
Age: 47
Ht: 5'8"
Wt: 186.5lbs
Body fat% 18-20%
Years of training: 20

Cylce
What I'm about to start is this: test-e 250mg + deca 200mg per week followed by test-c 250mg + Nandralone-cypionate 250mg per week for a total of 3 months combined. I can bridge cycles with 100mg per week of test-c per my HRT dose.

GOALS: I'd like to get to 200lbs over the course of 8-12 months while keeping my 32" waist. So 14 pounds of "clean" muscle I can hold on to if my source dries up and I'm back to only 100mg of test-c per week HRT.

Supplements: vitamins and creatine.

Based on what I've described, how vital do you feel PCT activities are going to be for me?

 

[9th Wonder]

Welcome to the board OP. If you want a list let me know, just shoot me a pm.

As far as PCT... It’s not necessary If you’re on TRT. A good supplement to try is DGA Post CT... it’s far more effective then HCG and will put your free test through the roof. It’s definitely the best test booster I’ve ever ran.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[buen]

Fark.....I don't even know where to begin...I'm truly at a loss for words
You guys handle it if you like ....I'm 90% sure the op won't listen anyway
GOOD LUCK

 

[RickRock]

This post is all over the place and hard to keep up with, but are you saying you are using 200-250mg per week continuously? You need to stick to and follow what your endocrinologist tells you to do and the dose he puts you on. Running these higher doses long term will have huge health complications

 

[pulphero]

I apologize for getting all over the place. I saw the sticky to put in those profiles with first post and be as detailed as possible, so if I went over board sorry.

As for not listening, this is the internet so I get why people would think that.

The part about long term effects for this dose I don’t actually understand. I have a HRT prescription. Once you go on hrt you don’t go off it’s not cycled. My prescription was for the lowest dose but a prescription for 200mg per week is common and I’ve never tested out of the 800s for test. —I did a forum search here and found an instance of a guy getting prescribed 400mg a week, which seems pretty high.

I’m a nurse and I was able to research HRT pretty well. I was also able to research some of the agents used and in what doses for HIV patients. But the truth is, very quickly due to American medical mindset, you realize that if you want info on stacks and some of the PED use stuff only, you have to go to people with experience.

Based on my research I have no idea why you’d think an HRT dose would have longer term health problems. I’m not even arguing you’re wrong—maybe you’re right—but we’re talking case histories of people on 100-250mg IM for years are very very common.

It’s the part where I cycle in the minimum doses of other low androgen agents that I can’t find any stuff. For the most part. Anavar and to a lesser degree Primo, are used with testosterone in HIV patients and they’re just put “on” not cycled, again with no mention of crazy health sides as a result.

As far as I can tell it’s also hardly uncommon for people in B.B. community to use bridge cycles so that effectively they’re never “off” and to do so for years at a time.

I was hoping maybe to find someone with actually experience doing that here to ask about on cycle experience over the long term.

I get blood panels drawn every 5-7 months since roughly 2011 and I’ve never had anything show bad.

Look if I’m about to explode please tell me. It’s just that nothing I’ve read indicates my liver is about to explode or break in brain tumors.

 

[pulphero]

So obviously my 1st post wasn't a big hit. I'm not sure what I did wrong other than sounding like a newb lol. The sticky said the more specific and detailed I was the better for advisers, so if I wrote a hot mess while answering the profile questions, I'm sorry.

I'm a nurse. I get blood blood panels about every 5-7 months and have for a couple of years. I was able to research HRT pretty well. I was able to research the doses of low androgen AAS used on HIV patients pretty well. What quickly became apparent is that if you want 'stack' information and PCT information you have to go to people with experience as pure med lit on it is pretty sparse in a coherent manner--that is you can find studies on HCG but Clomid use by men? Rare. etc. etc.

I'm on HRT so I'm never going off. I'm going to run low dose test for decades as prescribed and this is pretty much how it's done. Yes my dose was 100mg per week. But doses of 200mg per week/10 days are very common and also just "run" when on HRT; so I'm not sure why you're calling them "high" doses with long term health dangers? A forum search here showed a poster asking about his 400mg per week HRT prescription. I'm not arguing, you maybe right, I'm saying I'm confused. I'm reading of guys running 500mg of test-e/c for months and months with no sides. I'm reading of guys going on, doing 12-14w multi-drug cycles, then 'bridging' and managing the sides. So me taking a larger HRT range dose doesn't seem like I'm out there on the cutting edge pushing the envelope.

Same goes with low doses of mild androgen AAS in HIV patients. Patients are running Anavar for very long cycles, much longer than you see discussed on the women's "Anavar + Clen Are The Best!" forum discussion lol -- with no reported problems. The blood work done on that patient community is pretty extensive.

So, having said all that...I get why the poster above said he didn't think I'd listen--it's the internet. And after what I wrote I could see that as someone thinking I'm arguing. However I didn't mean that as "I refute you." I mean my own research left me scratching my head about the responses I got. This is a AAS/PEDs forum and I'm asking about running a low dose test stacked with 1-2 mild androgen steroids, not anything edgy.

Help me understand. If I'm running everything low enough that PCT during a cycle isn't needed then fantastic. And thank you 9th Wonder for mentioning the DGA.

Look, I got off on the wrong foot. I don't know how I did that, but I'm trying to reel it back in to learn some insights about mild androgen stacks, so, again, sorry if I rubbed people the wrong way.

 

[DylanGemelli]

i simply dont have time to read all of this... i get thousands of questions per day and while its important to not be too vague, you wont get a lot of responses with pages of posting etc... from what i have skimmed, you are asking if you need a pct while on trt and the answer is clearly no, you do not... i will tell you this, when you start getting over 200 mg a week on NORMAL trt dose, your bloodwork etc. may look okay at the time and you may feel okay but that does not indicate life span dude... i have been dealing with this for over a decade... that takes years off your life.. its not safe nor healthy LONG term... i dont give A FUCK about short term, you think long term and if you are okay shaving years off your life, then by all means, follow what bro douchebags post and say that have no care nor idea what lies ahead for them

 

[pulphero]

Glad I came here [not sarcastic]. I didn’t know this. I had read the Austrian jcem study saying older men keeping testosterone higher led to longer survivability, they seem to link it to DHT.

I admit to confusion as I came to an advice site about stacking some low dose low androgens for some cycles while running HRT and I seem to be getting a “steroids are bad response” which based on your YouTube clips I admit surprised me.

You seem like someone fully immersed in this which was why I came. I just didn’t think I was proposing playing with fire or death on the cycle I was curious might need PCT. you seemed pretty adamant about not doing cycles without PCT.

I appreciate you answering in person, I sort of just assumed mods and members would answer. Thank you for that. I'm going to edit the first post.

 

[DylanGemelli]

pct is the most important part of any cycle but that clearly would not apply to trt man... you dont need a post cycle when you blast and then just go right back to trt... clearly you want to walk around with healthy test levels but you are misunderstanding that with walking around too high... dosing over 200 mg week should put you over 1000 test level which is not wise to constantly be at... 600-800 is perfect range for long term health... you are not listening here or are misunderstanding...

 

[DylanGemelli]

you also are talking in extremes... listen, i advise people how to do things safe so they can have health and longevity... IF YOU FEEL you know better or you WANT to try something different, by all means, go for it... im not here to scare you or anyone else but i try to at least act like a doctor would where they tell you all the possibilities of what could occur or likely could occur...

 

[pulphero]

Okay. Sorry about being thick.

I have a prescription of test-c 100mg per week. The 10ml vial is 200mg per cc and is supposed to last about 4 months. When I bumped it up to 200mg it only lasts half as long (obviously) so I got an outside source. The source is always 250mg per ml/cc so I end up doing two months of 200mg per week and two months of 250mg per week. I can shave that if you're advising so.

I finished running 4 weeks of 50mg Anavar ED 4-5 weeks ago. Next month my intention is 3 month cycle of 200mg deca per week for first 6 weeks and 200mg nandralone for the second 6, stacked with my 200mg of week of test-c/e. Then I go back to the 'normal' 200mg/250mg per week of test-c I've been on. I was just curious if I should consider HCG or Clomid as a preventative against testicle shrinkage. Or maybe DCG as suggested.

I hear you saying that's not something you would worry about at those doses--but keeping my weekly test at 200mg or less is a long term safety measure.

 

[DylanGemelli]

Okay. Sorry about being thick.

I have a prescription of test-c 100mg per week. The 10ml vial is 200mg per cc and is supposed to last about 4 months. When I bumped it up to 200mg it only lasts half as long (obviously) so I got an outside source. The source is always 250mg per ml/cc so I end up doing two months of 200mg per week and two months of 250mg per week. I can shave that if you're advising so.

I finished running 4 weeks of 50mg Anavar ED 4-5 weeks ago. Next month my intention is 3 month cycle of 200mg deca per week for first 6 weeks and 200mg nandralone for the second 6, stacked with my 200mg of week of test-c/e. Then I go back to the 'normal' 200mg/250mg per week of test-c I've been on. I was just curious if I should consider HCG or Clomid as a preventative against testicle shrinkage. Or maybe DCG as suggested.

I hear you saying that's not something you would worry about at those doses--but keeping my weekly test at 200mg or less is a long term safety measure.

Post ct will be perfect for this scenario... its one of the reasons it was designed

 

[buen]

So obviously my 1st post wasn't a big hit. I'm not sure what I did wrong other than sounding like a newb lol. The sticky said the more specific and detailed I was the better for advisers, so if I wrote a hot mess while answering the profile questions, I'm sorry.

I'm a nurse. I get blood blood panels about every 5-7 months and have for a couple of years. I was able to research HRT pretty well. I was able to research the doses of low androgen AAS used on HIV patients pretty well. What quickly became apparent is that if you want 'stack' information and PCT information you have to go to people with experience as pure med lit on it is pretty sparse in a coherent manner--that is you can find studies on HCG but Clomid use by men? Rare. etc. etc.

I'm on HRT so I'm never going off. I'm going to run low dose test for decades as prescribed and this is pretty much how it's done. Yes my dose was 100mg per week. But doses of 200mg per week/10 days are very common and also just "run" when on HRT; so I'm not sure why you're calling them "high" doses with long term health dangers? A forum search here showed a poster asking about his 400mg per week HRT prescription. I'm not arguing, you maybe right, I'm saying I'm confused. I'm reading of guys running 500mg of test-e/c for months and months with no sides. I'm reading of guys going on, doing 12-14w multi-drug cycles, then 'bridging' and managing the sides. So me taking a larger HRT range dose doesn't seem like I'm out there on the cutting edge pushing the envelope.

Same goes with low doses of mild androgen AAS in HIV patients. Patients are running Anavar for very long cycles, much longer than you see discussed on the women's "Anavar + Clen Are The Best!" forum discussion lol -- with no reported problems. The blood work done on that patient community is pretty extensive.

So, having said all that...I get why the poster above said he didn't think I'd listen--it's the internet. And after what I wrote I could see that as someone thinking I'm arguing. However I didn't mean that as "I refute you." I mean my own research left me scratching my head about the responses I got. This is a AAS/PEDs forum and I'm asking about running a low dose test stacked with 1-2 mild androgen steroids, not anything edgy.

Help me understand. If I'm running everything low enough that PCT during a cycle isn't needed then fantastic. And thank you 9th Wonder for mentioning the DGA.

Look, I got off on the wrong foot. I don't know how I did that, but I'm trying to reel it back in to learn some insights about mild androgen stacks, so, again, sorry if I rubbed people the wrong way.

since you edited out of your original post...

You are not on TRT...you never received a legit diagnosis...you stated you purposely crushed your testosterone to fool the doctor to get a prescription for test...BECAUSE YOU WANTED IT..NOT BECAUSE IT WAS A MEDICAL NECESSITY
so..you are on a low dose continuous cycle...IE: cruising....a very uneducated choice

You also edited out your "cycle"..which amounted to 3 cycles back to back..consisting of 3 months duration each... using different combo's of AAS...

 

[buen]

Okay.but keeping my weekly test at 200mg or less is a long term safety measure.

Bro...dispute being a nurse and having done "research"...you are TOTALLY clueless
You ideas (taken from BB forums..not medical science) are totally WRONG
No one that really understands the FULL mechanics of exogenous testosterone ( or guys that do understand and just don't give a fuck about their health) would willingly give up their natural testosterone

If you truly understood any of this..you would be talking in total testosterone blood serum levels....(not in dosage..which is only relevant to what serum level it produces in YOU)
200mg/wk in 10 different guys can produce 10 different blood serum levels...200mg can produce levels of 1000 to 2000ng/dL
NOBODY USING 400-500mg per week is on TRT (btw..HRT is a term used in women)...that dosing would be producing total testosterone levels close to 10X normal...

TRT is a treatment protocol to return testosterone deficient men to a normal level...NOT BEYOND

You haven't mentioned your total testosterone level even ONCE...it's what needs to be monitored for long term health

The median average level for healthy males is 565ng/dL....only 5% of men have levels above 800ng/dL
If your normal level was 500 and you artificially raise it to 900... that is superphysiological level for your body...you can't compare it to what is normal in anyone else
reference range only refers to what is the range of testosterone measured in health males...IT'S NOT A COMPARISON SCALE..it doesn't mean 900 would be normal for you

 

[buen]

Age: 47
Ht: 5'8"
Wt: 186.5lbs
Body fat% 18-20%
Years of training: 20

Cylce
What I'm about to start is this: test-e 250mg + deca 200mg per week followed by test-c 250mg + Nandralone-cypionate 250mg per week for a total of 3 months combined. I can bridge cycles with 100mg per week of test-c per my HRT dose.

GOALS: I'd like to get to 200lbs over the course of 8-12 months while keeping my 32" waist. So 14 pounds of "clean" muscle I can hold on to if my source dries up and I'm back to only 100mg of test-c per week HRT.

Sorry brother..but this just doesn't fly
In your condition and being 18-20% Bf...adding more steroids is neither safe nor effective
As you have already proven this by your results....if you are willing to take a dispassionate look at the facts you'll see this is true

Anyone on 4 years of 200-250mg/wk of testosterone that can't maintain a consistent reasonable BF ..IE 12% .......does not know how or doesn't have the discipline to eat properly
Your diet and training are severely lacking...YOU HAVE NO FOUNDATION.....adding more steroids will not aid you in reaching your goal
Before cycling......You must build a proper foundation FIRST